Toyota Gurus Needed.

[240 Jordy]

My oldest son is now seriously looking at buying a 4Runner something in the early to mid 90s and I'll probably end up doing a SAS on it in the future.

I've always loved the Toys but have not researched much about them, So . . . .

Let's keep this positive please!

What years should we avoid?
What engines to avoid?
What (other than rust) should we look out for?

Found a 91 with a 3.0 V-6 close to 400K and doesn't pass aircare. Is this engine worth rebuilding? or would we be better to do a swap?

Any Positive help would be great!

:canadian:

[Jeremy]

There really are no years to avoid, I would try and find a 92 or newer (updated headlights and few other things). The V6 is a slug, its the V6 with 4cyl power and V8 gas millage. I get about 13-14MPG with mine all city but about 19mpg on the hwy. The V6 also has a very bad rep for consuming head gaskets. Mine has had 2 set prior to my acquisition of it (one Toyota OEM dealer installed engine as well) under the head gasket recall. been fine for the last 60k kms I have had it though, I would drive it anywhere in North America tomorrow if needed.

If you get a V6 plan on a swap to the newer 3.4L out of the 96+ 4runners and P/U's. I would like to do that but my 3.0L is still going strong albeit at a slow speed and drinking a lot of gas.

I would avoid Autos, although not bad they really make the V6 even worse than it already is, they suck up a bunch of power.

The 22RE in the 4runners are nice but hard to find and still do not get you any there in a hurry. It is arguably more reliable but they have lots of timing chain problems and HG issues too. Any 22RE 4runner you find should be a 5spd as well.

If the plan is to SAS it keep it low, the 4runner is top heavy I just spent two years trying to get mine down.

Now having said all that I maybe interested in selling mine. I find we are needing more space than the 4runner has with the dog and extra passenger (Robin).

Good luck with the hunt.

[240 Jordy]

I find we are needing more space than the 4runner has with the dog and extra passenger (Robin).


Thanks Jeremy!

How about a SASed Suburban to fit the family???




:canadian:

[Jeremy]

Thanks Jeremy!

How about a SASed Suburban to fit the family???




:canadian:

Haha Sorry that's a bit to big, needs to fit in my townhouse garage.

[CrimsonCruiser]

Yes, what Jeremy said.

I like the Gen 2's. Gen 3's are a bit bigger, heavier and cost more.
Gen 1... well, rust and the F'Glass top, 2 doors.
4 doors is VERY handy! (right Jeremy?) :cool:

Many don't rebuild the 3.0, they just do a 3.4 swap... (I'm sure Axel will chime in here!) ;)
One thing to watch is that auto's had different gearing.

I had a 22RE/5speed in my 4Runner and liked it a lot.
The timing chain issues on the 22RE can be solved with better guides.
They are really easy to work on and parts are plentyful.
With the right gearing (or tire size) it's perfect for a daily driver/trail truck.
I was getting 450KM's a tank on the Hwy and 400KM's city.
I had all seasons that I would swap back and forth.

My rebuilt 22RE had a RV cam (better chain guides) and a 2-1/4" free flow exhaust had some good jam. It would go up the Hope Slide loaded in 4th with the occasional drop the 3rd to get the revs up.

As for the chassis, they all rust over the rear wheel wells. The one's that look clean probally have bondo or been re-done with metal caps! :confused:

The rear brakes line rust out. If you do brake job, replace them regardless.
The rear window are notorious for not working.
Frames in the early models rust (check that)
The clutch pedal is notorious for cracking, (check that) easy fix. Some think it's the tranny when this happens

Gen 3 E-locker's bolt in with a bit of modification to the diff housing.
I had one in mine. LOVED it! Such a worth while mod.. and a bit cheaper than a ARB.

Jeremy and I (well mostly Jeremy) have done a lot of research on SAS'ing.
I guess you really have to determine if this will be a DD or a trail rig. A soft 4Runner trail rig is a bit scary to drive as a DD. Narrow and a bit top heavy for a soft suspension.
We recommend getting the "metal" parts from Trailgear and upgrading the "movable" parts to OE or better quality parts.

Even just putting FJ80 springs in the rear, cranking up the front torsions bars and a locker will get you most places. That will do you for a while while you plan the SAS.

I loved my 4Runner but it just wasn't big enough for my family.

M

[TheOtherSide]

Sweet... get the whole family wheeling & exploring.... and I suppose geocacheing too (can't spell it if I haven't done it :poke:)

:D

[240 Jordy]

Naw! He's not into Caching . . . For him it's Down hill Biking!



:canadian:

[bcghosttowns]

Can't go too far wrong with a yota but i personally perfer the pick ups.Not as top heavy and they dont eat rear springs.With a canopy you have the best of both worlds.

[highwaystar]

good points made! thoughts from one of the cult:

im on my second pickup with the 3.0 love it and trust it to take me way out to the middle of nowhere and back all the time.

The 4 runners are probably a bit too much of a vehicle for a 22re or a 3.0L thus the problems, but definetly liveable. Most do go to 400k and beyond with little trouble.

the 3.0ls HG main problem is when underhood temps go high, which is why the problem was bigger in the southern states from what i can see.

you kinda have to develop a toyota mindset while driving. If you have trouble putting along doing the speed limit then it may not be the right vehicle.

the V6 autos were rated at 14/16 mpg I think from the factory, the auto (while being incredibly robust and reliable) is indeed very inefficient. Its actually the same as the Ah3440 or A4w???? or something used in V6 and V8 Jeep cherokees. its an aisin.

my truck gets a documented 21ish mpg stock on 31s w 4:56s 5 spd so a speed runner probably 18/19?

another thing with the autos is if they are on a steep incline all the fluid will drain to the back and you will stop moving. but thats steep as in almost vertical. I think theres a fix out there?

you cant really go wrong. 3.4 swap is pricey but easy, there are 6 4runners on every forum being parted out at any given time! if i could id buy one! I really want a 2nd gen 4runner one day.

[TheOtherSide]

Naw! He's not into Caching . . . For him it's Down hill Biking!

:canadian:

Oh the memories of Whistler's downhill park... so distant. Been about 5 years since I sold my DH bike....:(

Can't go too far wrong with a yota but i personally perfer the pick ups.Not as top heavy and they dont eat rear springs.With a canopy you have the best of both worlds.

I would agree with the pickup for hauling a bike around... unless he wants to spend $ on a heavy duty bike rack for the hitch.

[Jeff]

Not a whole lot that I can really add here.

My 1990 4runner was a 3.0L automagic. bullet proof. the tranny pooped the bed when I first bought it but I'm sure that was due to previous operator error.....clutch packs where that neat dark brown colour :D Other then that nothing out of the oridnary ever went wrong in 400,000+km's

solid solid truck, it saw tons of every kind of road imaginable. With open diffs it held its own most everywhere i drove it. It even took 35's with very little work.

I used to do a lot of mountain biking myself. Two bikes will fit nicley in the back with the seats folded down.

There's potential to crame a lot more in there if need be..... I managed to shoe horn 9 people and all our winter mountaineering gear in to access a trail head once (I did cheat a bit with a roof rack).

[AxelR]

Only thing I'm going to add is that for what early FJ80's are going for now, I wouldn't even bother with a 4runner.

[CrimsonCruiser]

Axel makes a very good point and now that I have one, I love it! They are very solid vehicles. The ride is fantastic, nice and smooth. Feels more stable than my 4Runner. Lots of room.
The axles are huge when compared to the 4Runners. It has a Solid Front axle so no SAS req’d. That alone should save you ~$2000 and a bunch of work!
Can run 35’s with a standard OME lift…. And those are very reasonable. You can get a full kit for under $1000.
93-97 come with a front and rear locker option… that will save you a lot of money as well.

However, now that I’m an owner of one I can give you a few other thoughts...
- Gas mileage; unless you have deep pocket they will put you in the poorhouse. I’m getting 10-12MPG (city)
- They are AWD/4WD. They don’t come with a Partime transfer case (unless you install one)
- it’s not that fast… comparable to my 4cyl 4Runner.
- It’s physically not much bigger than a 4Runner, but it feels big... they are heavy. If you get a 91-92, you need to upgrade the brakes!
- Most American import models have Auto’s
- Parts… body part are harder to find and when you do, they are pricey. They might as well say Mercedes on them! ;)

Hindsight is always 20/20... For me, I should have gone straight to a Land Cruiser and skipped my 4Runner. It’s exactly what my family and I want in a DD/offroad/Expo vehicle.
Some may see it differently. If I was young and didn’t have a lot of extra money for operating costs and parts I “may” reconsider….and stick with a 4Runner or Truck.

[killer cruiser]

dh bike for sale. any interest!!

[240 Jordy]

Thanks for all the good input guys!

I agree with comments about the Land Cruiser over the Runner but maybe for his next purchase.

For now he has a 1990 SR5 3.0 liter 5 speed we picked up for $700.

Engine runs great passed air-care with flying colors, has near new snows and the interior is very clean.

The cons:

I need to weld the upper rear control arm bracket back on to the axle tube and it sounds like the rear wheel bearings are pouched, back window doesn't want to move but he says he can hear the motor trying to turn. And the usual rust of course.

So now I'm looking for some advice on some good on-line resources. So please post up some links.

I'm assuming the rear axle is a semi floater as it has the drop out 3rd member. Must be a bolted flange on the ends of the axle tube. I don't have the Runner at my place as my kids live with there mom or I would just go outside and look . . . LOL!

Anyway, any good links would be appreciated.



:canadian:

[Cody1771]

www.trailgear.ca has some nice stuff... and can get it at NSOR for the same prices as on the net.

www.4wheelparts.com has good stuff if you have someone in the states.

[240 Jordy]

I guess I should be more specific.

I'm not looking for aftermarket links, Hell I know what's out there.

I'm looking for tech articles, how-tos, repairs, blow apart diagrams, Toyota axle bibles . . . that sort of thing.



:canadian:

[GabAlmighty]

You can go spend a good few hours on yotatech.com TONS of info in there.

(don't think anyone mentioned it yet?)

Here is Pirate4x4's yota bible http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=775780

Hope it helps ya a bit!

[greentruck]

Anyway, any good links would be appreciated.


I don't pay much attention to anything except the 80, Camping Gear, and Trailer forums, but folks interested in Toyota mojo will probably find something useful at http://forum.ih8mud.com/

They have at least a couple of forums devoted to 4Runners, etc.

Then you'll always have easy access to the Dark Side, too -- Land Cruisers.:deal:

I can't speak for 4Runners. My last vehicle was a Rodeo and there's way more room in an 80. I know that the 4Runners were taller than a Rodeo, but they weren't that much wider:nono::rant:

If you're gonna put on lots of road miles as a DD, a Land Cruiser is probably a bad idea. But you can't beat the expedition and investment value of a good one. You don't feel like you're pouring money down a rathole quite so much...

It is a truck after all:pipe:
:D